Sarah Jane VS Torchwood

[dalekboy]

Everything that Torchwood got wrong and continued to get wrong for most of its first season, The Sarah Jane Adventures got right first time.

SJA is far and away the more enjoyable show to watch, the tone for what it wants to do is correct, the characters consistent, and most importantly, it left me wanting more.

Torchwood seemed rarely sure of what it wanted to be, and worst still, is written so that people act in ways that are out-of-character to forward the story, or more frequently, add an 'adult' feel with sex, violence or conflict. This made it kind of ordinary.

SJA feels written by adults who have a sense of fun and whimsy, who love what they are doing, and want you to love it too. It pulls out daggy ideas, knowing you will groan or laugh, and that you will enjoy them anyway. The emotional core of SJA works. And Sarah Jane herself is handled well. Wonderful, sad, and dotty in just the right way. She had a few moments that brought me close to tears.

Torchwood feels like it was written by teenagers revelling in being able to put in 'grown-up' things like sex. The problem is it feels shoe-horned in. The heart of Torchwood is a mess of confused, conflicting relationships meaning that no-one ends up being very likeable. And Captain Jack is not the man we loved in Doctor Who. Now that makes sense, given his situation, but means the character we most want to connect with we can't. He has some beautiful moments, but they are few and far between, and the actor himself seems uncomfortable with his part.

The adult show is often juvenile in its attemps to be 'adult,' whilst the kids show is the more mature. The best thing about Torchwood is it gave us a new script by P.J. Hamilton.

I won't buy Torchwood on DVD unless I see it cheap, really, really cheap. And then only for the link to DW, and for the Hammond story. If it has a writer's commentary for that episode, bonus.

I would buy the series of SJA unseen, based on the pilot alone.

Comments

[mikeybidness.livejournal.com]

On paper, Torchwood looks like the greatest thing ever. There's so very, very much you could do with it, even removed from the DW franchise. I'm so very disappointed they went with the decision to make it 'edgy'.

[angriest.livejournal.com]

I've never been able to shake the impression that we got Torchwood instead of UNIT: The Series because the former sends large royalty cheques to Russell Davies and the latter has them going to Derrick Sherwin.

A well-budgeted UNIT series, with a 21st century UNIT remodelled to be less like Dad's Army and more like CTU in 24, would have been brilliant.

I haven't seen Torchwood to judge it yet, so I'll keen an open mind, but it just doesn't enthuse me all that much. Not liking Captain Jack doesn't help.

[thinarthur.livejournal.com]

I suspect there's a lot of truth in that, esp as Torchwood is very difficult to slip convincingly into Oldtime Dr Who. That said, "The UNIT Show" would probably look similar to things like Stargate. What Danny says is pretty much true though it's worth remembering that if the same show had come out a decade earlier most people would have been pretty enthusiastic. Poor RTD, looks like fandom is starting to turn already, we'll have Dreamwatch articles in two years saying RTD must go!! I wonder if he'll listen to fandom opinions and revamp the show or just press on regardless?

[dalekboy.livejournal.com]

There are some good episodes of Torchwood, but it's a long time between drinks.

And you need to know why this Torchwood is so dinky. Even a line like, "All the funding goes to London," would do it.

[dalekboy.livejournal.com]

Fandom was already going to turn no matter who made DW. There were people who hated the new series right from the start.

I just find Torchwood bloody ordinary. It's a low budget X-Files that works best when it's not trying to be X-Files.

I think the problem is that we've seen genuinely good shows that used some of the same ideas - Stargate, Supernatural, X-Files. And it has the habit of the characters acting out in insanely uncharacteristic ways to add drama. I can't mention any without massive spoilers though.

So here are some made up ones for DW.

We're talking the equivalent of Mickey starts beating the crap out of Rose in an episode, just so the Doctor can stop him and he can be all angsty. It's out of character, it doesn't work, and you end up hating Mickey. Or Rose starts shagging aliens for no good reason, and gets an STD. Her dealing with it would work, except that she did it doesn't make sense.

And the Torchwood people are meant to be smart.

[nephron.livejournal.com]

I quite enjoyed episodes 1-3, but given people's reports about it I'm afraid to go any further :-/

[nevryn.livejournal.com]

*siddles up next to danny and whispers*

Psst. PJ Hammond. Not Hamilton.

[pedanther]

For what it's worth, I've heard it said that Rusty and co. have been forbidden to use the words "United Nations" in conjunction with UNIT, which would make a UNIT-focussed series a bit awkward.

(They managed to get through 'Aliens of London' and 'The Christmas Invasion' without being obvious about the fact that they never actually said what UNIT stood for, but the omission is apparent on the UNIT web site once you start looking for it.)

[davidcook.livejournal.com]

Yup, that's exactly my problem with Torchwood - the characters behave in plot-driven ways rather than as their actual character, which means that we don't have a coherent sense of their character. Also, they so often speak and behave unlike the way any real person would.

(and in the finale, their idea of "laying low" and being discreet is laughable. Or cringe-able, in my case. In one scene, I had no particular issue with what they were doing, but doing it at that particular time and place would have been a Really Bad Idea[tm])

[dalekboy.livejournal.com]

I thought 1 was good for a pilot, 2 was well-written but the whole sex-alien thing is hard to do in interesting ways, 3 was ok.

My picks from the rest -

5. Small Worlds - One of the best. Wonderfully creepy and weird.

8. They Keep killing Suzie

9. Random Shoes

10. Out of Time - Fabulous. Moving and interesting.

12. Captain Jack Harkness

13. End of Days - Crap, but important *sigh*

[dalekboy.livejournal.com]

God Dammit!

I went through, managed to pick every other transposed word and misspelling, and missed that. Grrrrrr...

Can you tell my brain melts very quickly these days? Does it show? *grin*

[dalekboy.livejournal.com]

The last episode is awful. No wonder the Cardiff Torchwood have no money - why would you give money to that bunch? Because of them following plot over character, they appear to have no self-control or ability to think rationally, they act like maladjusted children.

It's very hard to like what appear to be very stupid, selfish, thoughtless people.

[angriest.livejournal.com]

Was it Gareth Roberts or Mark Gatiss who invented the word "fanticipointment", that endless cycle of fans clamouring to see something and then condemning it once it arrives?

I've always found the criticisms of RTD's Doctor Who weird, because I haven't found the new series any better or worse than old Who - it's just essentially more of a series I love. Some faults have been rectified, and others have cropped up.

I wouldn't be surprised to see Russell leave after Season 4 though, and the fifth season get produced by someone like Mark Gatiss and be a lot darker and more scary.

[angriest.livejournal.com]

I have heard this too.