Just had a phone call. I may be doing another interview on being a sperm donor for The Australian. I feel quite cheery and chuffed about this.

The only sad side is that the journalist is from Sydney. Why is that a sad side? I've been asked because they couldn't find anyone in Sydney willing or able to do it.

Which isn't surprising - last I heard there were five active sperm donors in the whole of NSW.

From: [identity profile] mortonhall.livejournal.com



interesting ramifications when you think about there being only 5 active sperm donors in Sydney.

From: [identity profile] dalekboy.livejournal.com


Not Sydney, New South Wales. That's why some fertility clinics in NSW have five-year waiting lists. Albury gets a lot of people from Victoria for various reasons, too. They've cut off at something like 150 people, so now Canberra is getting the overflow.

Given that fertility is crashing across the world, and healthy couple are having trouble conceiving, they're going to have to make some major changes. Too many guys don't want the kids they helped create tracking them down in 18 years.

From: [identity profile] vegetus.livejournal.com


Or they could make adoption a better option. There are children in orphanages or in foster care that need love to in this world.

From: [identity profile] dalekboy.livejournal.com


The issues there are threefold.

Most people want children from a young age, and there just aren't many of those any more.

Most older kids have some fairly serious issues that many people aren't willing to take on. That's not the fault of either the kids or the adults wanting kids, it's just one of the sad facts of life. Some of these kids have been seriously messed up, and some people don't feel they can take that burden.

And the way the laws work, once you reach a certain age it gets really hard to adopt. So if you've spent years trying, had no luck, then decided to adopt, it may be too late. Don't know if it's the same for fostering or not.

My favourite Aunt took in a lot of foster kids over the years. Had a fair mix of horror stories and triumphs. One of the kids, now an adult with a family of his own, keeps in contact with her.

From: [identity profile] vegetus.livejournal.com


If people want to love and care for a child they should actually do that for children who need love and care rather than looking for a "perfect baby".

Whilst taking on a child that has been traumatised can be difficult, I also know many parents who have had their biological children become "difficult" (everything from violence towards other family members, drug abuse, emotional problems and suicide). You never know what a child will be like even if you raised them from day one.

Also I thought IVF had an age limit?

From: [identity profile] kaths.livejournal.com


From what I understand, adoption in Australia is very difficult, as so few children are now put up for adoption.

Adopting from overseas is also very difficult (especially for singles), expensive, takes years and years, and is fraught with situations where you are just about to take a child home and then things change and you can't. Heartbreaking. Some also feel that it's not right to take them out of their country and culture (although if it's that or a horrible life, I know which I think is more important).

Fostering is a completely different kettle of fish, because unless you are lucky enough to get a permanent foster situation, you are completely at the whim of the parents in terms of things like whether they get vaccinated, or even issues like hair cuts or taking them on holiday. Let alone the possibility of having to give them back at any time. It's a special person who does that kind of thing.

When you say people should love and care for children who need it etc, are you applying that to couples with no fertility problems as well? Why are they having their own kids and not all adopting/fostering etc? A statement like that should apply across the board, not just to those who have medical problems, or would prefer not to risk one-night stands to have children.

As far as I know IVF doesn't have a specific age limit, it's up to the discretion of the clinics. But the success rates are pretty low for those much over 40, despite the occasional success story.

From: [identity profile] vegetus.livejournal.com


Instead of spending money on IVF we should be spending it on opening up the possibility for more adoption. When the government pays millions of dollars for people to go through the umpteenth IVF cycle rather than helping making overseas adoption more affordable it seems a little bit more crazy to me.

The people I know who foster seem to have long term placements with the kids they look after which seems more stable (one of them has been looking after her foster son as a primary carer for 6+ years), though I'm not sure how they managed to get that rather than short term randomness.

From: [identity profile] dalekboy.livejournal.com


Actually, in most cases it's the people themselves paying for the IVF. There may be people who have the government paying for it, but I have yet to hear of it.

From: [identity profile] kaths.livejournal.com


There's a reasonable sized Medicare rebate if you're on it for medical reasons.

From: [identity profile] vegetus.livejournal.com


http://www.ivf.net/ivf/australia_to_cut_ivf_funding-o1396-en.html

Err no it's medicare subsidised- at several thousand a pop. In probably one of the few sensible things the previous government did, they wanted to put a cap on it for older women as the older you get the less chance you have of it being successful. Of course there was heaps of stuff in the media at the time about how dare the government not spend health funding on helping older women have babies. I also had an aunt who went through IVF and know that the government paid for a good portion of it.

Compare this to people who adopt from overseas who get no government support until the kid is in country and even then they only get the standard family allowance, no baby bonus or assistance with migration etc. (sorry I couldn't find a link but I read this in a book about international adoption for Australian parents)

This happens when you are a demographer, you remember crazy stuff like this because it affects your work. You also develop a love/hate relationship with Peter Costello!

From: [identity profile] kaths.livejournal.com


Like anything, it's not a matter of 'either/or' with funding.

And I'm sure there's a lot of things the government pay for that people would object to, to some extent! Eg Quit programs (no one forced them to take it up), lap band surgery (no one forced them to eat), emergency services (no one forced them to drive too fast and hit a tree).

Don't forget that the drive to have your own children is extremely strong, and for most, adoption is only an option if all efforts have failed. And why should some people be able to have their own children and others can't, just because eg their fallopian tubes are blocked, if a medical process can get around it (literally)?

I agree that overseas adoption should be *lot* easier, and the government should help with that, but I think a lot of the restrictions and costs are coming from the overseas countries themselves.

I think you can specify what type of fostering you prefer (eg babies, older children, long term, short term), but I don't know how much choice you end up getting.

The fostering process is pretty intense and slow too. Shame a lot of 'natural' parents don't get the same kind of 10th degree!

From: [identity profile] emma-in-oz.livejournal.com


Many people who need sperm don't need IVF or any other expensive procedures. They just need sperm.

From: [identity profile] capnoblivious.livejournal.com


Too many guys don't want the kids they helped create tracking them down in 18 years.

I really don't understand this attitude. From my point of view, that's the best bit, and I'd be disappointed if the kid didn't at least express curiosity.

From: [identity profile] kaths.livejournal.com


I think it's particularly sad when the child doesn't have a chance to track down their biological father. It should be totally up to them as to what contact they have, but how horrible when they want to and can't get any info because it was a 'anonymous donor' situation, like it is so much in the US. Particularly when medical issues come up where a medical history could be useful.

I chose a donor who seemed very open to contact, so that at least the child has a good option in the future.

From: [identity profile] dalekboy.livejournal.com


The other thing that gets me is that a good chunk of these guys who don't want a kid tracking them down are happy to have unprotected sex, which can lead to the same situation, not to mention a fabulous collection of STDs.

From: [identity profile] kaths.livejournal.com


I just can't relate to that, or even the idea of donating anonymously. If I have genetic offspring out there, I want to know about it!

From: [identity profile] mortonhall.livejournal.com


Sydney/NSW - doesn't mean a lot of difference to me :)

I was actually considering the genetic ramifications of having a small number of sperm donors available.

From: [identity profile] dalekboy.livejournal.com


I was think five people in Sydney doesn't sound like much, but it's not absolutely awful. Five people in NSW is far worse.

Well, how's this for a scary figure - forgetting my demon-spawn that [livejournal.com profile] shazgirl is currently carrying, I may father anywhere up to twenty kids!

If that happens I shall have to move my LJ to a new one called Jizzmaster!

From: [identity profile] meljane.livejournal.com


Totally missed the post on Shazza being pregnant on her journal and your journal due to housesitting for my parents in the last month and small amount of internet at when I was home and at work .

Congrats to both of you from both of us *hugs* and big hugs to Sharon and the demom spawn (better than giant spawn).

From: [identity profile] kaths.livejournal.com


They have a 'family limit', so it's not like in the US where some donors can have huge numbers of offspring.

I think Vic is in a better situation because the laws on identification have always been more open here, so when the laws changes around Australia, they didn't lose a lot of their donors. Or something like that.

From: [identity profile] dalekboy.livejournal.com


Just had confirmation from the head of the Sydney unit, who was chatting to me to be sure I was up for the interview. Three active donors, two waiting to come out of the quarantine period for all of NSW.

A lot of Victorians actually use Albury because for various reasons they have trouble in Vic, due to the laws. I think (I may be wrong) it's easier for lesbian couples and single mothers to get IVF outside Vic.

And I had to pass on the wording used by the chap I spoke to - The single mothers are draining the sperm banks dry - it's a disconcerting mental image, that one!

From: [identity profile] kaths.livejournal.com


Yep, in Vic lesbians and singles can only have access if they qualify for IVF due to fertility problems, or IUI (syringe method) due to ovulation problems. Hence so many going to Albury. Although that'll change in about 6 months as the law is changing.

People I've heard talk about the issue say they don't think the changes in Vic will make much difference (ie draining the sperm banks dry) because with the increase in use of ICSI (injecting a sperm into the egg), particularly with it now getting a Medicare rebate number, less couples need donor sperm, so there's more to go around, so to speak.

In terms of NSW, if there's only 3 active donors and 2 waiting, then nobody can actually be draining it dry, there's nothing to drain! Qld doesn't seem to have the same kind of waiting lists, and I didn't have to wait in VIC. Sounds like they need to do a better recruiting job.

The guy you spoke to probably read this: http://www.news.com.au/story/0,23599,23077288-2,00.html

....

Okay, I've just looked up the info I have access to.
Canberra fertility only have a couple of local donors. Monash Qld have about 15 donors, Monash Vic have 20. Monash seems to have a fair amount overall and share it amongst their various clinics in Aust.

IVF Australia have an 18 month waiting list. It's been said that they're the only ones inS ydney with donor sperm, but Sydney IVF have a few with a 6 month waiting list.

Some clinics import from the US (more info, but more expensive), eg Fertility First and Fertility East in NSW (although apparently they have a couple of local donors).

Only 2 WA clinics have donors, and they have a long waiting list. SA has a few but only for IVF, not IUI. TAS is pretty limited.

All this changes from month to month as they use up donor sperm and gain new, and the demand varies, but it gives a vague idea.

Another factor which will impact is that I think they're reducing the family limit from 10 to 5. Not sure if it's per state or not - didn't you find something out about that?

From: [identity profile] dalekboy.livejournal.com


RE: the article, John Braine is who I was actually speaking to.

And, as far as I know, and I may be wrong, it's still ten families total, but only five per... state or capital city, not sure which.

With the legislation changing all the time, it's hard to keep up.

From: [identity profile] mireille21.livejournal.com


The law changed recently in Vic with regards to singles and lesbians I believe.

From: [identity profile] kaths.livejournal.com


Yep, but it won't be put into effect for another 6 months probably.

From: [identity profile] emma-in-oz.livejournal.com


WA's system has effectively shut down and they have just rejected a move to increase the no of children from each donor to 10 from 5.

From: [identity profile] kaths.livejournal.com


It's amazing how different it is in different states. In some ways I'm lucky to be in Vic in that there is a resonable supply, but on the other hand I had to jump straight to IVF (luckily I qualified), couldn't even give IUI a go (unless I did it myself).

From: [identity profile] damienps.livejournal.com


I did the sperm donor thing when I was at Uni in Tassie. They were advertising in the Uni Newspaper. 18 years ago I got a about $120 for wanking.

From: [identity profile] dalekboy.livejournal.com


They actually can't pay you any more, though they are allowed to give you money to cover expenses, like if you've taken a taxi, or had to have time off work.

From: [identity profile] mireille21.livejournal.com


Yeah, I read the thing about there being only 5 donors as well, which is just mindboggling! Surely there are more people out there who are willing and able? Maybe it just hasn't been suggested to them yet.

From: [identity profile] kaths.livejournal.com


Until they see the interview with Danny :)

Danny, did you ever get a copy of the other one you did?
.

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